Project Natal

[Reykjavik]

I just finished watching the microsoft press release on gamespot Linky (http://e3.gamespot.com/press-conference/microsoft-e3/)(watch the last 30 minutes, all though just about all of it is interesting)

and it looks like they are taking gaming in a whole new direction. Project Natal is a motion capture type of 'controller' that eliminates the need for a controller. All of the things they demoed were things where precision wasn't needed, so I don't know if it will work well with competitive games like shooters and the like, but it might.

What it does is bring interactivity to a whole new level, which might make gaming through Onlive obsolete, unless Onlive has something similar. I am guessing that Microsoft won't let Onlive get their hands on Natal, but there isn't anything preventing Natal from working with Onlive as far as I can tell.

However, Onlive will still be a more affordable option for high end gaming, and what it looks like to me is this:

Onlive takes old fashioned gaming to a whole new level, while Natal invents new fashioned gaming.

What do you think the effects of Natal will be on Onlive, and the gaming industry in general?

[Lord Xenu]

None whatsoever. MS is trying to innovate due to the fact that they are behind the curve on the whole motion idea. While it is a neat idea they aren't exactly doing anything new. After seeing it today, it is currently just seen as a gimmick. It may change in the future but the common feeling was "gimmick". We will see how well they support it.

[AlexTheLion]

While this is an interesting concept, it is not talking specifically about Onlive, but about a competitor to Onlive, so I'm moving this thread to the Other Video Games Discussion thread. :D

I'm with Niko on this one, I don't believe this will have any effect on Onlive or on the Gaming Industry, they are scrambling for ideas to compete with other successful motion capture systems (mainly the Wii), and I believe this will just fall through the cracks. I must admire MS's concept, I don't think it will "take" with the gaming world.

[NeuralVomit]

Personally the Eyetoy + was far further through development. It looked much more refined, even if that 'wiimote' style accessory was kind of blah.

I did personally enjoy the 'vs sitting on the couch waggling a stick' dig at the Wii, though.

[Darq]

The Natal does look interesting. The painter demonstration seemed a bit odd to me, but I suppose it was just to show what could be done with it. I think that Natal could perhaps bring back some hype about virtual reality. All in all I wasn't terribly impressed by the concept.

[Soulz]

The Natal does look interesting. The painter demonstration seemed a bit odd to me, but I suppose it was just to show what could be done with it. I think that Natal could perhaps bring back some hype about virtual reality. All in all I wasn't terribly impressed by the concept.

Thats exactly what was running through my mind it's like a step closer to virtual reality gaming

[1narm]

xbox.com/en-US/live/projectnatal/ - DOWNLOAD SILVERLIGHT youtube.com/watch?v=p2qlHoxPioM

[Klayman676]

I dont see why natal wouldnt work on Onlive, u would just need the cmera thing. maybe they'll make something that makes natal think Onlive is an Xbox.

[Alfrayer]

Project natal wouldn't ever come onto OnLive unless microsoft buy them but its the technology that i personally think would not be compatable. Performing one to one motion is gonna have to be even more responces than controller inputs as you're not gonna comprehend for the delay. Add this onto the fact that Onlive already has the latancy in place and things like natal will need to go through extensive algorithms to translate movement into game code. It will just take too long for one action to be translated onto the tv in front of you. Opinion of course, but logical reasoning.

[Aph0ticShield]

I dont see why natal wouldnt work on Onlive, u would just need the cmera thing. maybe they'll make something that makes natal think Onlive is an Xbox.

The problem is drivers... there won't be any PC driver... therefore no OnLive driver.

[chrisrobhay2]

Sony has always had the Eye Toy which is almost exactly like Natal.

[Tyrokiller]

Sony has always had the Eye Toy which is almost exactly like Natal.

Not really, natal's tracking software seems to be much more advanced than that of the eyetoy. Sure, similar but by no means the same technological wise.

[chrisrobhay2]

And what if Sony just released a software patch for Eye Toy that made it capable of what Natal can do AND released their new motion-sensing controller? Then M$ would be screwed when it comes to motion-sensing controllers.

[Tyrokiller]

And what if Sony just released a software patch for Eye Toy that made it capable of what Natal can do AND released their new motion-sensing controller? Then M$ would be screwed when it comes to motion-sensing controllers.

Not really since the eyetoy is based on hardware from many years ago meaning that the speed it is capable of determining actions would be far slower than a newer counterpart. The only way sony would be able to create a similar technologically capable system would be to release an entire new eyetoy with much more up to date hardware.

Furthermore, Sony is attempting to copy the wii by allowing only the motion controller to be tracked whereas the xbox is allowing your full body to be tracked allowing it a far wider range of abilities. For instance the PC currently has a system called "TrackIR" Xbox's natal could also emulate this type of behaviour since it tracks the body whereas the Ps-mote can't since it only runs off of a controller.

[chrisrobhay2]

http://www.thesixthaxis.com/2009/07/16/pseye-already-has-natal-features/

Read the article. It says Eye Toy can do almost everything Natal can, an if they release a software update, it would eliminate the "almost".

[Outlawed Toker]

http://www.thesixthaxis.com/2009/07/16/pseye-already-has-natal-features/

Read the article. It says Eye Toy can do almost everything Natal can, an if they release a software update, it would eliminate the "almost".

so the eye has 2 separate cameras, one being a infrared camera not only to double what it sees, but to pick up any movements in complete dark? i dont think so.

also, i have seen the resolution of the eye camera, and to have face recognition in families (aka differentiate from father and son how only look different by age). maybe it could do the voice recognition, but not the face recognition.

the eye toy is years old, and the camera in it is just outdated. even with software updates, it wouldn't be up to par with the natal. I mean have you seen any of the natal demos? That thing is on point, no interference and no problems.

I can't say the same for my use with the eye toy. and of course that article is going to say the eye toy can keep up with natal, its a playstation site.


your welcome to believe whatever you want to believe, but trust me, you will see when natal is released.

[chrisrobhay2]

Why would Sony flat out like that about the Eye Toy? It obviously is close to being on par with Natal if they say so. THey can't just lie to everyone like that.

[Outlawed Toker]

yea, because major corporations never lie to their consumers right?

don't get me wrong, the eye toy is a great product, but given the current hardware specs of both, the natal is going to be more on point than the eye is. it's just the way technology works. for example, if you bought a computer 4 years ago for $800, and i just bought a computer for $800, you are trying to tell me that your computer is as fast, and can run all the applications and do everything at about the same speed. Thats just not possible (unless you upgraded it).

They knew what was in the eye toy when developing the natal, and they knew to succeeded they had to ramp it up and go one step further.

Sony is capable of having an eye toy like this, i just think they would need to release a whole new model, not just software updates.

[NeuralVomit]

Why would Sony flat out like that about the Eye Toy? It obviously is close to being on par with Natal if they say so. THey can't just lie to everyone like that.

I lolled :D:D:D

Can you explain to me how M$ would be screwed? M$ have the greatest market share atm. by a long shot. And with their continual upgades to their services, XBLA community net, constant working with governments like Australia so we get the same stuff the rest of the world does?

Natal is much further along development wise than Eye Toy - to the point where they have given models to developers to already start making games for it. Perhaps you didn't see the part where they mentioned the ET+ was one of several projects they had been 'trying' that were in alpha. ALPHA.

Natal is practically launch ready, they just need a killer game to bundle it with.

[Outlawed Toker]

yea man, but one thing on his defense, the eye toy has been out for years

lol, i take this from the small article that you were making quotes from (meaning you obviously read it, well maybe not, because there is no reference to any alpha stage of the eye toy mentioned)...

"Sony have now realised that the product they’ve had on shelves for years is capable of almost all the things Microsoft wanted us to think they’d pioneered with Natal."
^^(and yes, the statement in the second part of the sentence is bs, as i was talking about before)

http://everseradio.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/06/facepalm.png

[chrisrobhay2]

Oh, I am sorry. It is not Eye Toy, it is Playstaton Eye.

[NeuralVomit]

Oh, I am sorry. It is not Eye Toy, it is Playstaton Eye.

Actually, hate to tell you this.

Eye Toy - PS2 accessory to begin with - though was slated to be released with PS1.

The project which they showed at E3 - was originally the Eye Toy + - because all it is, is additional firmware for a 7 year old device, keeping with Sony's belief that all their hardware has a 10 year life cycle.

They rebranded the Eye Toy + project, to the Playstation Eye. Same stuff, internals are identical to what they were, just a firmware patch.

So yes, they realised that they could change some firmware to make it do what was needed. But note, it is my belief that they will not be able to do facial recognition + identification to the extent Natal will.

This is further proven, by the need for the 'sticks' or what I call the blue and red lollypops (Sony stated @ E3 that the device was in Alpha, and because of that, the sticks weren't indicative of the final product by any means)

You will notice, that with a stable device - Natal has just as good 'perception' as the Playstation eye has. And that Natal has, on top of this, facial and body recognition and identification, identification being key here.

It's a massive leap from head recognition (note, not facial) to Full body, facial is about 8 points, compared to the body being about 64 ( those statistics were made up, just from my memory of the e3 conference and that article.

I wish the PSeye lots of luck, because without competition, innovation doesn't occur. Unfortunatel at the moment, M$ has the better product. When M$ releases natal, I daresay we will see a Sony product that does better things, within 2 years.

~NeuralVomit.

Because it's just like the way apple steals from google.

[Guitarbandit90]

Meh. I don't think anyone will be able to kill our good friend, the good old-fashioned gaming controller. :D

[chrisrobhay2]

I hope not. I mean, motion-sensing and full-body tracking are cool, but nothing beats a controller (except maybe a mouse & keyboard, which is debatable). Especially when playing shooters.

[Halow]

It looks like a good system for motion play but I don't see many great games coming out on it thats more than a cheap novelty atm.

[Onlivefan#1]

Some human souls are seriously some upperclass douchebagging faggots ok the day onlive was first heard about some loser that expreses his oppinion cuz he is on the big I says o its a piece of shit and it will never work then he compares it to a sega that was made idk 70 years ago right when the big I was found. Now this comes out it is still the same scenario except the sega thing. In my oppinion I would love to sell drugs to a red head faggot ukwim. Also In my oppinion if something works it just works. Plus i didnt mean to be a hippocrite for expressing my oppinion and in some ppls opp. it was a fucking gay one